https://tylerpaper.com/sports/college/ut-tyler-patriots-win-national-baseball-championship/article_06e4ec12-6378-11e8-a2ad-a324394c9281.html

Figured most of you are already aware, but good for them.

I just hope they never get around to adding football, though they are getting much closer to us in terms of enrollment.

I think it is only a matter of time as they climb the ranks.

Trying to go Division II

http://www.kltv.com/story/37235397/ut-tyler-applies-for-division-ii-status-could-bring-college-football-to-tyler

My first grade teacher in Fort Worth, many decades ago, got her PhD and was one of the first faculty members when the college opened as a "senior" level school. From 1971 to 1998, the school was for junior, senior, and grad students only. BTW, they have an on-campus baseball/softball complex seating 1,000/750 respectively.

D2 NCAA football allows 36 scholarships compared to FCS 63.

http://www.uttyler.edu/news/pressrelease/2018/02022018.php

I attended UT-Tyler back in 1976 at the age of 6 and was a student's case study in reading.

SFAXE93 said:

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I attended UT-Tyler back in 1976 at the age of 6 and was a student's case study in reading.

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I graduated from SFA in 1976 and was a case study in .... never mind.

SFAJack_76 said:

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SFAXE93 said:

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I attended UT-Tyler back in 1976 at the age of 6 and was a student's case study in reading.

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I graduated from SFA in 1976 and was a case study in .... never mind.

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Oh, Lord. Texan's feeble attempts at humor have become contagious.

SFAXE93 said:

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I think it is only a matter of time as they climb the ranks.

Trying to go Division II

http://www.kltv.com/story/37235397/ut-tyler-applies-for-division-ii-status-could-bring-college-football-to-tyler

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We don't have to worry about them as a divison 2 team, but I'd guess their goal is division 1.

All these universities in the greater East Texas catching up to us in enrollment, growth, & now sports means we need to keep setting ourself apart from the pack over the next several years.

We've got the AD to take us into the future, now to buy Patillo a fancy watch.

UPDATE: UT TYLER Division II

Someone brought this up on another message board, but what effect does anyone think this has on SFA? They seemed to believe it would have a big effect, I don't see it that way.

Thoughts?

cboothe09 said:

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Someone brought this up on another message board, but what effect does anyone think this has on SFA? They seemed to believe it would have a big effect, I don't see it that way.

Thoughts?

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D2? Not too much, especially without football.

But a future D1-FCS with football? They're only 2k behind us in enrollment & rapidly growing. If their goal is eventual D1, it could have all sorts of effects on SFA, from athletes to prestige to academic resources.

The time to cement our status an upper mid level Texas University & the de facto University of East Texas is now, not after UT Tyler catches us.

And then today:

https://www.cbs19.tv/article/news/local/ut-tyler-under-investigation-for-possible-title-ix-violations/501-574835902

Ok...I live in between Nac and Tyler...will be relocating next year but I see a lot of both universities. Here is my take on UT Tyler....

1. Tyler os STILL growing. Lots of $$$ in Tyler, good shopping (for the area) and entertainment compared to Nac. They also have the Cowan Center, which brings some decent acts to ETX and...LOTS of donors. I'm thinking these donors will also be ready and willing to donate to an Athletic program, too.
2. Other than the Nursing program, I really don't hear a lot about their academics and they really don't have an identity. They also ate not student centered AT ALL and I know this from personal and professional experience. Comparing interns I've had from Tyler and SFA, SFA has always been better prepared.
3. Some students go to UT Tyler as a feeder school to UT...they didn't quite hit that GPA mark and can transfer in after a semester or year. UT TYLER also targets international students.

My take is that is that, like Texan emphasized, SFA needs to establish itself as THE school to attend in ETX. Keep winning championships, expand on facilities, and concentrate on academics, too (building up more on line programs will help). I feel that fresh, new leadership is needed in this new era. We need to capitalize while we can.

My 2 cents.

Pilotgirl said:

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Ok...I live in between Nac and Tyler...will be relocating next year but I see a lot of both universities. Here is my take on UT Tyler....

1. Tyler os STILL growing. Lots of $$$ in Tyler, good shopping (for the area) and entertainment compared to Nac. They also have the Cowan Center, which brings some decent acts to ETX and...LOTS of donors. I'm thinking these donors will also be ready and willing to donate to an Athletic program, too.
2. Other than the Nursing program, I really don't hear a lot about their academics and they really don't have an identity. They also ate not student centered AT ALL and I know this from personal and professional experience. Comparing interns I've had from Tyler and SFA, SFA has always been better prepared.
3. Some students go to UT Tyler as a feeder school to UT...they didn't quite hit that GPA mark and can transfer in after a semester or year. UT TYLER also targets international students.

My take is that is that, like Texan emphasized, SFA needs to establish itself as THE school to attend in ETX. Keep winning championships, expand on facilities, and concentrate on academics, too (building up more on line programs will help). I feel that fresh, new leadership is needed in this new era. We need to capitalize while we can.

My 2 cents.

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Exactly this. A few thoughts on it as well, as I grew up outside of Tyler & still technically live in the area.

UT Tyler is by and large a commuter school. A ton of my hs classmates went there and I don't know of one who lived on campus, or a single person who's attended a UT Tyler sporting event. That'll change as they move up in competitiveness & increase the number of students.

UT Tyler doesn't have a ton of academic programs that they are known for, but they have the UT name, which means more anytime someone moves out of state or to another area. Dumb as it may be, that UT brand name, even for a branch campus carries increased weight.

That said, there is a lot of money in Tyler, they have a bank on every corner. It's why we should play some scrimmages there for football/basketball/baseball, because there are also a lot of Lumberjacks. There's no reason we can't siphon off some of that sweet donor money that's available in town.

We definitely need fresh new university leadership. We're at a fork in the trail, time to take the route to the top of the mountain, not the easy, well worn path to mediocrity. If we don't act now, SFA will be forced to join a large university system to keep pace & catch back up in 10 years.

Yup.

I remember there was talk of joining a university system like UT several years ago...I was either in undergrad or grad...we all HATED that thought. Enrollment increased so problem and BOR decided against. Enrollement has since decreased again...

It was Texas Tech. Enrollment has been between 11,900 and 12,800 for 15 years. When you say down, it was down about .9% last fall. Spring was down .1%. .1%. Read that again. We need to grow but the myth that enrollment is down is simply not true over the last 15 years. It has simply not changed in a statistically significant way. NOW I'M NOT SAYING THAT IS GOOD BUT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO SAY ENROLLMENT IS DOWN.

Well it's down from its peak at 13k in 09 or 10. But yes, it's not changed much at all in two decades, which is quite the shame considering how often that's been one of the center points of our strategic plans for the last decade. When I checked earlier, it looks like Tarleton has officially passed us on enrollment.

I like independent SFA, but I wouldn't mind throwing in with Tech.

Personally, if we had to join a Uni system, I'd call TWU & Texas Southern and pitch them on creating our own Uni system based around serving a diverse group of students across Texas. But that's a pipe dream at the moment.

Woah....I don't know if it's pick on the new "poster" person day or what (I kinda have an idea of what is going on & no worries I'm totally used to it)...

First, I said decreased. And, per your #s, an almost 10% decline is a decrease and drop in enrollment..especially to start the academic year off with...
Second, hovering over those same #s for 15 years is STAGNANT. That is 100% evidence that big decisions need to be made and things change, especially when other universities are growing.
Thirdly, I can do statistics night and day. Non parametric, parametric, whatever...data crunching is part of my job. And I guarantee that people at SFA are crunching these #s...it may not look on the surface as being statistically significant but you only know that when you run the tests. Like Texan and I are saying, if SFA is fine with staying as is, cool. Otherwise, they need to look at other options, especially if they want to continue to draw recruits for sports.

Enrollment was always a BIG topic of discussion when I was going to school there and working there...and the conversation was always on how to increase & maintain. If they reached a level where they want to maintain, congrats. But I don't think they have.

Finally, there are tons of peeps saying the same thing I am. So I'm wondering why you decided to reply or single me out? Because I'm new here or was it just a general reply? I'm not here to debate or argue with anyone but I will bite back when someone uses all caps and comes at me when everyone else on this board is saying the exact same thing.

I do apologize if I misunderstand your post. It just seemed odd to me. I literally just want to talk about basketball and SFA.

Maybe I will just head back to Twitter LOL.

Hmmm I may can get some more info about the news story and Title IX...

TallTexan said:

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Well it's down from its peak at 13k in 09 or 10. But yes, it's not changed much at all in two decades, which is quite the shame considering how often that's been one of the center points of our strategic plans for the last decade. When I checked earlier, it looks like Tarleton has officially passed us on enrollment.

I like independent SFA, but I wouldn't mind throwing in with Tech.

Personally, if we had to join a Uni system, I'd call TWU & Texas Southern and pitch them on creating our own Uni system based around serving a diverse group of students across Texas. But that's a pipe dream at the moment.

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Like I said. It got up 12,800. That's sounds like almost 13,000 to me.

Pilotgirl said:

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Woah....I don't know if it's pick on the new "poster" person day or what (I kinda have an idea of what is going on & no worries I'm totally used to it)...

First, I said decreased. And, per your #s, an almost 10% decline is a decrease and drop in enrollment..especially to start the academic year off with...
Second, hovering over those same #s for 15 years is STAGNANT. That is 100% evidence that big decisions need to be made and things change, especially when other universities are growing.
Thirdly, I can do statistics night and day. Non parametric, parametric, whatever...data crunching is part of my job. And I guarantee that people at SFA are crunching these #s...it may not look on the surface as being statistically significant but you only know that when you run the tests. Like Texan and I are saying, if SFA is fine with staying as is, cool. Otherwise, they need to look at other options, especially if they want to continue to draw recruits for sports.

Enrollment was always a BIG topic of discussion when I was going to school there and working there...and the conversation was always on how to increase & maintain. If they reached a level where they want to maintain, congrats. But I don't think they have.

Finally, there are tons of peeps saying the same thing I am. So I'm wondering why you decided to reply or single me out? Because I'm new here or was it just a general reply? I'm not here to debate or argue with anyone but I will bite back when someone uses all caps and comes at me when everyone else on this board is saying the exact same thing.

I do apologize if I misunderstand your post. It just seemed odd to me. I literally just want to talk about basketball and SFA.

Maybe I will just head back to Twitter LOL.

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Not sure I get where your going. I said almost the same words as STAGNANT. You are wrong that the variance is 10%. It is about 1-2% over the past ten years. We peaked (as Tall pointed out) at 12,900 in 2009 to a low of about 12,300. That is Stagnant as we have both said...... I agree. The university enrollment has not changed more 3-4% over past 10 years. That's a far cry from 10% which would indicate a variance of about 1,280 students.

I added a zero and shouldn't have ( and yes, I know what variance means )I think the major point here is that it is, for all practical purposes, minimal change (may have some change decade to decade). If we want better facilities, better recruits, keep good coaches longer, and good professors/successful programs=More $$ = More enrollment. It is as simple (lol) as that.

Do I think Tyler is going to have an immediate impact? No. But 5-10 years down the line...yes. Especially if SFA does nothing to change the status quo.

I think we're all describing stagnation, just differently lol. Either way, if SFA is going to make increasing enrollment a strategic goal, then by all means let's get it done.

The last strategic plan that I saw put a number/year to enrollment goals was around 15.5 by 2015. I think that goal was written around circa 2008 if I remember correctly.

I don't think SFA should pursue growth for growth's sake, but I think a real plan to get to 15-17k is fine. We don't need the insane growth levels that A&M/SHSU are experiencing.

Nice recap. I never saw the draw of UT Tyler. But, that's me.

I procrastinated on applying for school and a buddy had me go apply with him a month before the semester started. That's how I ended up there...Since procrastination played such a big role in my life at that time my tenure was short lived...
Got my act together, got to Nac and finished strong in the end...

Pilotgirl said:

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I added a zero and shouldn't have ( and yes, I know what variance means )I think the major point here is that it is, for all practical purposes, minimal change (may have some change decade to decade). If we want better facilities, better recruits, keep good coaches longer, and good professors/successful programs=More $$ = More enrollment. It is as simple (lol) as that.

Do I think Tyler is going to have an immediate impact? No. But 5-10 years down the line...yes. Especially if SFA does nothing to change the status quo.

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Agreed......

I am going off memory so forgive me if I'm wrong, but Marshall posted the enrollment numbers in the lobby of the SFA Theater (when it was still a movie theater). As I recall, there was an increase in the '80s and enrollment was just over 11,000. You want to talk about stagnant. A change somewhere around 10% in 30 years is stagnant (much like Nac population).

SFA88 said:

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I am going off memory so forgive me if I'm wrong, but Marshall posted the enrollment numbers in the lobby of the SFA Theater (when it was still a movie theater). As I recall, there was an increase in the '80s and enrollment was just over 11,000. You want to talk about stagnant. A change somewhere around 10% in 30 years is stagnant (much like Nac population).

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Meanwhile, the population of Texas has grown by 98.9% since 1980.

I'm not saying we should have 22k students, but dang, we've barely grown at all. Was on campus with my Dad in January, he's class of 87. He was like why do we need all these new buildings & dorms if we still have the same number of students as when I graduated.

My overall goal for SFA is more of a prestige one, I'd like us to be viewed as being in the tier right under UT/A&M/Rice in academic prestige.

So it would look like this:

UT/A&M/Rice
SFA/UT Dallas/SMU?
SAM Houston/Lamar/everyone else

I know that's simplyifying it a bit, but no reason our "teaching University" can't be seen as above average to high in terms of a quality education.

But, if our administration keeps trying to push enrollment growth as a strategic goal, by all means, get it done. Maybe we should put Keller & Crittenden in charge of that too?

I'm hoping the new STEM building will draw some students in...that was a big goal. Was talking to my girl about this topic and she has a good pulse on things SFA. As a proud 'rent, she received an endowment there 3 years ago so yay! Anyway, the people that run the endownment & others she works with keep talking about how SFA needs to increase #s...so yes, it is still part of their plan.

Back to the focus on facilities, academic programs, and sports to do all that!

And yes I think that is the perfect tier to place SFA. There is no reason we can't sit well at 15 to 16k. That sounds like a good # to me. Heck, I went to a HS with 3000...lemme go recruit my HS....

Thought this was interesting:

https://tylerpaper.com/news/local/ut-tyler-announces-year-development-plan-during-convocation-includes-plaza/article_71e6719e-a7b0-11e8-a98f-37c84fcb427e.html

And a direct quote from the UT Tyler President:

"We aspire to be the primary educational and economic driver of East Texas."

Plan also includes a 7500 seat indoor arena for basketball & other uses.

That's awesome. Honestly, I'm gonna give this a positive spin. SFA just needs to keep up with the Jones'....now can they with Tyler $$$ is the question. But....let's not let them stake claim to East Texas region like they just did lol

The nursing thing makes sense bc that is what Tyler decided was going to be their calling card a looooong time ago. But lets take all the other programs, please!

Definitely this is good for Tyler and East Texas,and good for SFA if we choose to keep up with the Joneses.

My main concern is that our admin just seems complacent when it comes to things like this. I wish they would think big and dream as big as the rest of us.

Ivey certainly seems to, now let's see the school admin do it.!

Pilotgirl said:

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The nursing thing makes sense bc that is what Tyler decided was going to be their calling card a looooong time ago. But lets take all the other programs, please!

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Speaking of this, I want to see SFA pursue a College of Health. Take Nursing, Speech Therapy, Nurse Practitioner & Counseling and put them under the same school. Then add Physician Assistant, Physical Therapy, Occupational therapy, and assistants programs over time.

Those are all excellent careers and would be a huge benefit to East Texas and rural Texas in general.